I am considering installing a high volume oil pump conversion kit on the stock front cover of my '87 GN. The kit basically consists of a 1/4" spacer plate and longer gears. The kit's instructions advise removing the front cover for the installation. I believe removing the front cover is for access to drill holes for two pins which positively locate the spacer plate. I would like to install this kit without removing my front cover. I think I can locate the spacer plate appropriately without drilling for the locating pins. Has anyone done a similar installation without removing their front cover? Am I in for any surprises or is this a fairly straight forward install? Thanks for relating your experiences.
High Volume Oil Pump Conversion Kit Installation
- Thread starter slipstick
- Start date
Squid4life
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Jul 5, 2004
slipstick said:
I have done it, but I did it on the bench. The pins aren't just a temporary thing to locate the plate and align it. They PERMANENTLY locate and align the plate so that it won't move at all and bind the gears. If you have looked in the kit you should have a small super-thin shim that you wrap around the gears to provide clearance when drilling the holes for the pins. That should show you how much clearnace or margin for error you have (or DON"T have).
I would ASSume it can be done on the car, but it makes life easier on the workbench. :biggrin:
machinegun
Active Member
- Joined
- May 25, 2001
Personal preferrence, do not install HV oil pump. The extra load on the cam, front cam bearing have caused issues. I have built a number of engines and have not used a HV pump. Blue print the front cover is a great idea, check all clearances and clearance the end play on the pump gears. All this will do more than just an HV pump. Why are you wanting to do this in the first place?
Machinegun,machinegun said:
Thanks for your reply. I am not convinced that I need or want to do the HV oil pump conversion. However, when I see my hot idle oil pressure at approx. 10 psi and higher RPM oil pressure at approx. RPM x .012 (e.g. 3000 RPM x .012 = 36 psi) I begin to wonder if a HV pump may be adviseable. Again, these examples are with the engine very warm and the oil is a half and half mixture of 10w-40 and 20w-50. Also, the engine has less than 2000 miles on a complete rebuild with proper clearances. If I must remove the front cover to do the job I probably will not do the deal. However, if it can be done with the cover in place, I may try it (thinking that if I do not like the results it can be as easily undone). Also, I have a friend who has several thousand miles on his HV front cover '87 GN and it seems to be "no problem".
Squid4life
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Jul 5, 2004
If you are wanting more oil pressure without pulling the cover, get a shim/gasket kit from TA performance. They come in a pack of different thicknesses. Basically you use plastigauge, dry the gears, put plastigage in, torque the oil filter adapter, remove it, check clearances, use the gasket with the correct thickness you need, check it again, and be done. .002 - .003 is optimal I believe.
machinegun
Active Member
- Joined
- May 25, 2001
Slipstick, Your oil pressure is just fine. Idle oil pressure hot is usually 8 - 12 psi. You are right one. I have over 100,000 on the one engine and 10,000 on the other. Both run the same oil pressure as you. IE 2200 rpm is 23 psi. Yes this is hot. I use a 10-40 synthetic and so far have no problems. I even spit a head gasket on the 100,00 mile motor. Personally, i would leave it alone as you are well within spec.
Red Regal T
Senior Member
- Joined
- May 24, 2001
Well, you've heard from the anti HV pump crowd, now I'll add my 2 cents. I've been running them forever, with no problem. I've heard all the reasons for not installing one, but I've never had any of the problems myself. I think most of it is hearsay from people who were afraid to try one because of negative comments made by others who never used one. 
If I had a choice, I'd always opt for a HV pump. If you have lousy oil pressure, and a HV pump installed, you know you have another problem. It's easier to drop the pan than play around with your oil pump installed on the car.
As far as trying to install a HV pump with the timing chain cover still installed on the car, should be easy enough if you have FIVE HANDS.
If I had a choice, I'd always opt for a HV pump. If you have lousy oil pressure, and a HV pump installed, you know you have another problem. It's easier to drop the pan than play around with your oil pump installed on the car.As far as trying to install a HV pump with the timing chain cover still installed on the car, should be easy enough if you have FIVE HANDS.
Red Regal T said:Well, you've heard from the anti HV pump crowd, now I'll add my 2 cents. I've been running them forever, with no problem. I've heard all the reasons for not installing one, but I've never had any of the problems myself. I think most of it is hearsay from people who were afraid to try one because of negative comments made by others who never used one.
As far as trying to install a HV pump with the timing chain cover still installed on the car, should be easy enough if you have FIVE HANDS.
Red Regal - John
I do have enough friends to find five hands for the job and I agree that from my experience (actually my friend's experience) HV pump front covers cause no problems. In fact, my observation of his car is the reason I'm considering this modification. I appreciate the opinions and advice of those who say "leave it as it is" and I may very well do that. Steve V advises "do the deal on the bench or leave it as it is". Still, I am not convinced this project cannot be accomplished (with care) while the front cover is on the car. More opinions please??????
"Friend" has 3000 miles on his high volume pump. That's certainly enough to give you some confidence that it won't hurt anything for 3000 miles. How about 10,000, or 50,000, or 100,000? How much will you drive the car? High volume is a good match for an engine with high clearances. If your engine builder builds them "loose", then a high volume pump is needed. If you put a high volume pump on a "tight" engine, then you will end up with too much oil pressure, and too much load on the drive gear, and on the front cam bearing. You only need enough oil pressure to get adequate flow to the bearings, at desired rpm. Any more is wasted.
I don't have to shoot off one of my toes to know it's not fun. It is possible to learn from others, and to use common sense.
I don't have to shoot off one of my toes to know it's not fun. It is possible to learn from others, and to use common sense.
