The problem with racing "classes"...

KevinB said:
Man, I hope there never is a block change in TSM:eek: It would no longer be the stock block class, rather a smaller turbo TSO class.
Click to expand...


I agree and love the stock block part of it. The fact is though this class will turn into who survives a race in the low 9's without breakage.
 
Dusty Bradford said:
2 local TSO cars are in the works now. 1 will be ready for BG for sure. It's ready to fire as soon as I get time to set the distributor up.

No way I'd personally do a TSM car and dump that money into a $200 block knowing it's a matter of time before the oil pressure goes to 0 and it's split in the webbing. I think TSO is just as expensive as a top TSM car now. Maybe not for the 1st motor but the 2nd and 3rd catches you up quick;)
Click to expand...

That's great to hear. I look forward to you guys in the pits. Are you going to race the series?

VERY little cost difference between a top TSM car and a TSO car. As a matter of fact there are a few TSM cars that cost more to build than most TSO cars. The only real difference is the block and turbo. After you are done prepping a 109 block it is probably a wash for a used on center S2 block. The turbos a little more $$ but only a few bucks more for a PTE88 over a GTQ70
 
turbobuick said:
That's great to hear. I look forward to you guys in the pits. Are you going to race the series?

VERY little cost difference between a top TSM car and a TSO car. As a matter of fact there are a few TSM cars that cost more to build than most TSO cars. The only real difference is the block and turbo. After you are done prepping a 109 block it is probably a wash for a used on center S2 block. The turbos a little more $$ but only a few bucks more for a PTE88 over a GTQ70
Click to expand...

We'll try to make as many as we can but we all work these crazy swing shift rotations so we only have every other weekend off. You run out of vacation real fast if the race falls on the work weekend.
 
Not knocking anyone, but need a few explanations, please...

Correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems to me that the TSM class erequires the use of a stock block...So what happens if you're using a stage or an aftermarket block?...in which class are you going to end up? I don't understand why the rules are insisting so much on using stock blocks knowing that they're not reliable at these power levels (unless you're using steel caps, girdles, head clamps, etc...) as an aftermarket, one which is built stronger to begin with...What's the point in insisting on that?...just to prove they can go fast? Yes, we all know that they can go fast...but for how long?...Most of them eventually end up cracking or blowing apart...:rolleyes: Wouldn't it be better to allow the use of an aftermarket block but keeping the rest of the rules as is, just to help the racers in having engine with more hope of longevity? If set up the same way the cars would run the same, but would be a lot more reliable and be much less prone to breakage...:confused: and be more FUN for everyone, no?...:confused: If I decided to spend some serious money in building a race engine, it would seem obvious to me that going with an aftermarket block would ensure a longer lasting engine...:rolleyes: but I might be wrong...
Are the rules for TSO and TSM the same except for the stock block in TSM?

Thanks for reading this and possibly explaining...

Claude :)
 
TSO is pretty much an all out class limited to stock suspension and 88mm turbo's. These cars are now into the 8.30 range right at 170mph

TSM was never intended to go as fast as they are. The record was 9.9 after the first race....now it's 9.14 so it's went much faster than anyone ever thought possible with a 70mm turbo. The turbo and engine tech has come so far that the 70mm turbo can support nearly 900hp. The emphasis has always been on the 109 block and 70mm turbo to see how far it can go. Everyone will be watching this year to see if the racers can figure out how to make them live and run the low 9's on a regular basis. Now that everyone has stroker motors there's not any difference if the stage blocks were allowed. The cheapest thng to do for competittion though is to back the turbo limit back down to 67mm or so. It's up to the racers to decide what they want.
 
Otto J said:
I heard Ted A's TSO car ran faster then 170 in testing:eek:
Click to expand...

After looking at Fiscus 167mph logs I know it's possible. But since Ted's guys don't believe Dave ran 8.30's I don't believe Ted went 170. You know if it ain't on video, it never happened:rolleyes: Remember if someone goes faster than them then they are either cheating or lying....usually the guilty ones are those that accuse others;)

Either way. The weather were Ted would run is much better than we'll see when they all get on the same track.
 
Dusty Bradford said:
After looking at Fiscus 167mph logs I know it's possible. But since Ted's guys don't believe Dave ran 8.30's I don't believe Ted went 170. You know if it ain't on video, it never happened:rolleyes: Remember if someone goes faster than them then they are either cheating or lying....usually the guilty ones are those that accuse others;)

Either way. The weather were Ted would run is much better than we'll see when they all get on the same track.
Click to expand...

Well I dont know Ted to be a liar,And now that i think about it,That number never came out of his mouth or was typed by him.I believe **** ******* posted it,And I am a fool to believe anything he says(or types)
 
"Otto J, I went before on that site and wasn't able to see any rules...On the home page, I clicked on "Race and Show" which brought me to a second page where I clicked on "Race Rules"...This brought me to an almost blank "Buick GS Club of America" page, except for their logo in the middle of the page, but no rules there either..:(

Claude :redface:
 
toofastforyou said:
"Otto J, I went before on that site and wasn't able to see any rules...On the home page, I clicked on "Race and Show" which brought me to a second page where I clicked on "Race Rules"...This brought me to an almost blank "Buick GS Club of America" page, except for their logo in the middle of the page, but no rules there either..:(

Claude :redface:
Click to expand...

Ya i just tried also
Ill let them know,It is quite possible they havent locked this year rules up
at this point and that is why.
 
2fastforU, I feel ya man. I agree 100% with everything you've brought up. Bracket racing is more demanding and challenging for the racer himself and less demanding of his wallet.
 
Having FUN...

Don, I'm glad you agree with me! :wink: All through this thread, I wanted to emphasize that the most important thing for me when I'm racing is TO HAVE FUN!...Heads-up racing may be more intersting to some which are usually the same faster guys who end up having fun time after time. Bracket racing gives EVERYONE a chance at winning and having FUN once in a while...:wink:
I don't have anything against heads-up racing, but it's more intended for a few select guys who usually happen to have a lot of knowledge, connections with some parts manufacturers and also big wallets... What a coïncidence!...:biggrin: Even if I had an 8 or 9 sec.car, I'd still race it in the bracket classes because it's more FUN for everyone, slow or fast.
Remember the key word...is having FUN!!!

Claude :)
 
The BPG event in Columbus is trying a heads up alky injection class with an 11:00 breakout....really a street car driven class but with a pro tree....pick out of a hat ladder (no qualifications) has to meet weight...any turbo...all NHRA saftey requirments for speed and times...Oh and we are going to meet at a spot out side of the track and drive in to the staging lanes...street car style....Slicks are still a debating point....other than that pretty much anyhing else goes...
 
LET THE AVERAGE GUY HAVE A CLASS FOR ALKY/TRs ON DRs

That should be an easy decision. :confused:


Drag radials only...no slicks. This class was supposed to be about every-day

performance by every-day TR owners in every-day TRs w/alky.


How many people w/alky have DRs? How many have slicks?


2 slicks w/wheels can easily bust $1000-1200, plus the hassles of

lugging them to/from Ohio. Just getting to & from Columbus with their

car @ today's fuel costs is going to strap more than a few, & now

you're also going to up their chances of driveline breakage by requiring

slicks? So, how will they get their car home if that happens? Some

will be spending their last available nickel in just getting there w/DRs.


So now, they're out finding another G-note+ they don't have or

can afford in order to participate, plus increasing the likelihood

of being stranded w/costly out-of-town repairs and/or transport costs?


IF the idea is to encourage max-participation...DRs only.


Guys w/o slicks...most of the TR world...would also have to re-learn

how to launch their car on slicks vs. DRs, and they'd be on the trailer way

before acquiring the best technique for their car. Plus, this may be the

first time some have even thought of racing at a track...so they're going

out to buy slicks & wheels for their first (& maybe last) event?


Requiring slicks in an 11.0 alky-class is counterproductive & exclusionary,

IF the goal is leveling the field & encouraging the most

participation by track-newbies and/or the average TR owner w/alky.


The any-Turbo clause in this class has chased away enough already.
 
wasn't to say you must have slicks...that they are an option....it was at first going to be a no slick class....the any turbo rule...there are many guys with big turbos on the street.... the 11:00 breakout will allow some tight races...without people mashing on the breaks at 140mph
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

D
hot wire probems white racing
Replies
9
Views
1K
Doug G
D
T
  • Locked
  • Sticky
TSM 2024 Official Rules
Replies
0
Views
472
Tweeked6
T
J
Found an 87 GN that has been sitting for 10+ years in storage..
Replies
10
Views
549
granitestategn
G
J
better weather plans for your TB
Replies
0
Views
136
jlat
J
P
Winter storage for alky system???
Replies
6
Views
337
Mr.Spool
M
Top