Pulling heads in car, min. needed to come off?

[TulsaGN]

I'm pulling my heads while leaving the motor in the car--I realize it's easier to do if you pull motor but I have no cherry picker, stand, or room--anyway...what needs to come off to get the heads off. Mainly, do I need to take off the accessories ie alternator and A/C? If I undo the headers, will they hang back out of the way and what about the downpipe? Thanks!

 

[SouthernCal GN]

1) remove fuel, coolant, vacuum, and electrical lines (all tagged to make it easy to reinstall)- don't forget the grounds at the back of the PS head! remove inlet piping.

2) remove intake (complete)

3) unbolt headers/turbo support bracket.

4) unbolt AC/alt/PS bracket. let hang.

5) remove heads.

 

[sweetv6]

I'm pulling my heads while leaving the motor in the car--I realize it's easier to do if you pull motor but I have no cherry picker, stand, or room--anyway...what needs to come off to get the heads off. Mainly, do I need to take off the accessories ie alternator and A/C? If I undo the headers, will they hang back out of the way and what about the downpipe? Thanks!

there is a montage i did from a Buick Board a couple years ago

hope it help

Claude


-------Re: about to change head gaskets..
Jay, the headers, crossover, turbo, pwr steering pump, tensioner, A/C compressor,
alternator, and intake will have to be removed. I marked sandwich bags and used
masking tape so I could write the location of each bolt. I put the accessory bolts in
one bag, intake bolts in one, turbo bolts, header bolts, etc. in separate bags.
Put antiseize on all exhaust/turbo related bolt threads or replace with stainless steel.
Water will run down into the lifter valley when the heads and intake are removed
unless you remove it to a lower level. Some have removed the block plugs
(squarehead below the motor mounts) to accomplish this. I couldn't remove
mine so removed the bottom rear head bolts (one on each side) and sucked it
out with a turkey baster. This was tedious, however, if you're unsuccessful,
the pan should be removed and cleaned.

The heads can be pried (to gingerly break the seal) off fairly easily. Once the
seal is broken, lift and move the passenger head forward a couple of inches to
gain easy access to the two ground bolts in the rear. Move the driver side
forward a couple of inches to easily remove the TV cable bracket bolt.
Reverse this procedure for the install and put a piece of cardboard between
the gasket and head until the head is finally stabbed onto the dowels.

Use a razor scraper and try to keep material from entering any holes or the lifter valley.

Use brake cleaner for final cleaning because it leaves no residue. Spray it onto a
shop rag for cleaning.

Once cleaned, check the block deck and heads for flatness using a good straightedge.
This is mandatory and could save you lots of frustration. You may want to lay the bare
heads on the block and try pressing down and rocking to test for uneveness. Some
will lay them down then use a light to search for gaps.

ARP bolts are the preferred fasteners. Thoroughly clean the bolt holes
(both intake and head) with taps. Don't forget to apply thread seal
(bottom 1/4" of each bolt) and 30 wt oil on the threads. Torque the heads down
in sequence to ten pounds. Use a Felpro intake gasket (the pan type) and install
according to directions. Torque the intake bolts to 15#. Torque the heads,
in sequence and in ten pound increments, to 80#. Torque the intake to spec.
Let sit overnight.

It will take longer than six hours but if its done right you won't have any regrets.

Good luck, Joel


Registered: May 2001
Location: Spokane, WA
Posts: 796

I divide the job into parts.

Disconnect bat...drain radiator...drain oil and leave catch can under pan with plug out.

Remove the wiring....don't worry about where it goes back (unless you've changed
some connectors) as it'll just fall back into place, kinda, and the connectors only go
to their intended sender.

Top of engine....as someone said...remove the complete manifold and all it's crap
in one piece. I ALWAYS put bolts back where they come out of....and tape the
threads if necessary to keep them in their correct holes.

Front of engine. Ditto on bolts and the AC compressor you just tie-tape over to the
side without disconnecting the lines. (This is assuming it's the driver's side gasket).
If it ain't, leave this stuff on and disconnect the turbo garbage. I leave the turbo on
the manifold and just let it dangle against the fender.

Depending on the side remove that ex. manifold and you now have the head (s) left.

While I remove the wires at the back of the pass side head AFTER the head is loose
I put a small piece of plywood under the head to protect it and the block.

Clean the deck and all the gasket crap. I pour a quart or 2 of oil down the valley to
wash any bits of gaga left in there. You will get water into the pan when you remove
the heads so the cleanser oil will help wash it out.

Clean, clean, clean. I use alcohol to clean all the gasket surfaces as a final cleanser.
Head gaskets go on dry...I still think the stockers are the best for stock engines but
they may be discontinued. Don't reuse the stock head bolts if they were stock.
Get ARP and put the white sealant and the lube on them. Torque to spec in the
proper order. I start in the middle and work out, oppositely. And in 10 lb increments.
Each person has their own opinion regarding the correct amount of torque..
I've used 70, 75 and 80. Take your pick...lol.

When you put the intake gasket on, again, I like stock.. put a small dab of
whatever color RTV you're using into each corner of the rubber pieces where
they touch the heads. I also smear a thin layer of the RTV onto the intake gasket
sealing surfaces.

Bolt everything back on.

It used to take me about 8 hours....3 to take everything off and 5 to put it back on.
But that was when I use to drink so it was probably a one hour job in reality.


Last edited by ChrisCairns on October 18th, 2002 at 05:41 PM

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October 18th, 2002 05:39 PM



turbodave231
MI Buick Performance Club

A couple of tips:

If you are doing just one gasket......consider doing both. The other one is ready to go!!
Ask me how I know

1.Once you have the exh manifolds off, pull the block drains on either side of the block
before you pull the intake and heads off.

2. Drain and pull your oil pan. If you are using the stock composite headgasket
(and I highly recommend you do) you will have graphite particles throughout the
engine. With the oil pan off, you can clean the valley area real good with brake
clean and get all the crap out of the oil pan. Plus you can take a peak at a bearing
or two the make sure everything else is ok.

If you don't clean out the junk, you'll have bearing problems later.

3. Check your heads (or have them checked) for flatness. I like to have the
heads resurfaced just enough to clean them up and I ask my machist to leave
a rough finish (to grab the gasket).

Good Luck!
Dave


Which ARP Bolt Goes Where?
I just went through this drill...

The shortest bolts go at the bottom portion of the head near the exhaust ports (4 per side.)

The medium length bolts go in the rocker arm area, 2 per side.
Put them in the front and the rear holes.

The longest bolts go in the rocker arm area, 2 per side. Install in the 2 middle holes.

Don't forget the special washers, lightly oiled. Make sure the bevel is toward the bolt.

I won't recommend a torque. 82 ft-lbs works for me, but do a search,
there are lots of opinions on this one.


PERMATEX® Copper SPRAY-A-GASKET® Hi Temp Adhesive Sealant

I used it on my GM intake gascket

Fast drying, metallic copper sealant helps dissipate heat,
prevents gasket burnout and improves heat transfer.
Fills minor surface irregularities. Seals instantly. Fills hot
spots and surface imperfections.
Temperature range -50°F to 500°F; resists all types
of automotive fluids, especially gasoline. Level 2


P/N
-80696 4 oz. Can 12
-80697 12 oz. aerosol can 9 oz. net wt.


----------------------------------

Head milled vs compression


Head milled .025-.030" (43cc) w/stock .060" = 8.55 cr
" " " " " 1000 Fel Pro .0375" = 8.86 cr
" " " " " 2 steel shim .036" = 8.95 cr
" " " " " 1 steel shim .018" = 9.31 cr

Stock (48cc) with stock gasket .060" = 8.122cr
Stock " with P/N 1000 Fel Pro .0375" = 8.40 cr
Stock " with 2 steel shim .036" = 8.48 cr
Stock " with 1 steel shim .018" = 8.79 cr
----------------------------------

 

[turbofish38]

I just did the HGs on the GN. In a nutshell anything that bolts to the cylinder heads and intake manifold.

 

[salvageV6]

This thread still valid for a stock headgasket replacement?

Rockers Off pistons whereever.... 90 psi Into gauge 1.
Leakdown #1 35 psi.
Leakdown #3 77 psi. 15%

Chuffing muffled sound into intake from #1 area when idling not loud idles okay.

Air seems to be going into the intake, car runs fine, oil fine, plugs fine, BLM's a bit whacked at idle etc.
Slight smoke into car on "heavier" acceleration (light or no boost) no oil spraying I can see out of breathers.

Probably only going to do stock replacement, ARP BOLTS not studs assuming there's no issues with those bolts otherwise I'll try and find TTY stock bolts.

The blue coated intake gasket the right one?

Arrrrgggghhh

 

[salvageV6]

Are these stock headbolts? Couldn't find a pic. of one anywhere from the top...

Bought this one used so I have no idea what's been done to it.

 

[pacecarta]

yes , bolts are stock , a couple head bolts will have C and a few will have SPS on head , they should be replaced

valve springs have been changed , stock they would have a external dampner cup around them

felpro blue 96033 intake gasket

 

[pacecarta]

youll need to pull the pan and clean the headgasket graphite fibers from the pickup screen

 

[TexasT]

Mine was dr side so that is the one that came off. It went back on with a victor rienz gasket, and arp studs on that side. Pass is still factory seal on it at about 175k miles.
I didn't pull the pan but did do a couple of short oil n filter changes.

 

[salvageV6]

I did the valve springs, should have mentioned that.

Thanks for the tips and info.

Pretty sure I have the Victor Reinz or GM gaskets whoever made those 8 years ago or so.

I just tried to fit a Victor valve cover gasket into the valve cover and of course in a couple of areas it doesn't fit well. I got a whole pile of cheaper cork ones that do fit but wanted to use the pro thicker one, just my luck...

I probably should do both sides we are at 241K now.....

Unfortunately it will be 90 degree days with 60% humidity.

I do have the studs somewhere, but ordered the ARP bolts, looks like the pass. side is the only issue getting the head off with the studs? Then there's the washer and re-torque and voodoo dance routine I would have to learn....

Wait till we get to the intake gasket questions, stay tuned, probably start mid July on it after I'm sure I have all the right parts and chemicals on hand.

 

[TexasT]

The newer studs have a hex in the top to make removal easier. Pass side looks harder with the HVAC stuff there. I'm sure bolts will be fine.
I bought a felpro valley pan and vc gaskets. Used black stuff out of a tube on the ends and corners of the intake. I used some Indian Head stuff on the bolts that go into the water passage. Works good on water pump/front cover bolts too. It doesn't harden so retorque is no prob. Lots of guys like the arp stuff or other. Might consider a water pump while you have it apart if that hasn't been done in a while.

 

[salvageV6]

What is a Fel-Pro 8723PT1 good for found it in a GM wrapper opened?

I have a GM 25528486 as well says L HD on the wrapper do these things fit both sides?

 

[grass doctor]

the gm 25528486 is the OEM head gasket ...has a little thicker fire ring IIRC...pretty sure they are good for both sides

 

[salvageV6]

Ok whose bright idea was it to put the vacuum line bolt in the intake right under the IACV?
Had to get them off to move the fuel return out of the way.

And how do you get the nut off the hoist loop stud without it rotating into the other fuel line?

And how badly do you have to bend the fuel lines out of the way to get the intake off?

What about that back bolt under the tranny dip stick tube holder.

I can see why a lot of people have problems with these cars once they're really wored on....

Okay that was a joke since I do need help from those people.

 

[TexasT]

Put a prybar or big screw driver in the loop on that lift hoop to keep it from moving while removing and installng to hold it where you want it.
The back of the head trans tube bolt can be gotten from underneath with a 3ft extension and universal joint.
Stock fuel lines have a rubber section so they should be able to flex to get I take off.

Once some of these people with limited tools get loose and don't put everything back these cars are not too fun and you can see why people won't work on em. And why many just don't run well after being "worked on".

 

[TexasT]

After thinking on it, that trans dipstick tube is bolted to the trans to engine bolt on mine and I'm pretty sure it is like that from the factory so I'm thinking you don't need to fool with that unless someone has attached it to the head.

 

[salvageV6]

Not sure if my dipstick is bent, doesn't look like it, but it's right on top of the back intake bolt and the boss in the intake is blocking access to the bolt as well from the front side. Might need unbolting of the tube mount or a slight massage to get a wrench on that back bolt.

I tried the prybar, will try a crowbar next, or bigger arms..... ie. help, one with the 1/2" drive and one on the bar.

Some stuff that's been on 33 years just doesn't want to come off, excepting the little bolt that holds the water lines to the intake, that popped right off when I tried to undo the flare nut that goes in the intake, have to see if there's any good threads left in there. It needed to come off so I could get the water valve out since the hoses were kinda stuck into it.

Thanks for the help! Probably only a week to go if it keeps raining here.

 

[salvageV6]

A minor victory, lost the nut of course, found the right metric thread stainless nut with a 17mm head should fit fine with neverseize. All the tools you need right here for the headgasket job, bigger prybar, 2" pipe, 3 lb. hammer. 1975 Craftsman toolbox helps a bit too.

 

[salvageV6]

Amateur hour in the headgasket destruction dept.

 

[salvageV6]

Whos bright idea was it to put the harness bolt in the back of the intake like that buried behind the coil mounting bracket?