Loud pump??

[VIN7]

At part throttle, zero boost I get a loud buzz on the shifts. 10-15 degrees retard, I've been all over underneath looking for anything hitting and cannot find it. On the logger it shows a one big spike and quickly decays. At WOT 0 kr.

At idle as I pull the tv cable there is a loud buzz. At full tv a slight buzz, but at about half tv there is a loud buzz that you can hear/feel through the cooler lines.

Any ideas?

 

[quickt]

At part throttle, zero boost I get a loud buzz on the shifts. 10-15 degrees retard, I've been all over underneath looking for anything hitting and cannot find it. On the logger it shows a one big spike and quickly decays. At WOT 0 kr.

At idle as I pull the tv cable there is a loud buzz. At full tv a slight buzz, but at about half tv there is a loud buzz that you can hear/feel through the cooler lines.

Any ideas?

Sounds like Max pressure popping off. What happens in Drive?

 

[Steve V]

Lonnie...interested to see what you recs are to fix it.

 

[quickt]

Lonnie...interested to see what you recs are to fix it.

Replace max pressure spring. They tend to break on the tip and lower the opening point. When that happens they make a loud buzz when pressure is relieved. Also the gauge kinda supports that with the erratic pressure. You can also have a weak slide spring or worn pivot pin but I think that's unlikely.

 

[Steve V]

Max pressure spring the same as PR spring? Or is it in the VB?

 

[quickt]

Its the spring in the pump that is held in with a pin. The spring sits on top of a steel ball and limits max pressure.

 

[VIN7]

Its the spring in the pump that is held in with a pin. The spring sits on top of a steel ball and limits max pressure.

Lonnie, do you have a picture where this spring is located?

I only see two springs in the pump, the slide spring, and the little spring that goes under the pivot pin.

 

[TexasT]

It is in the outer pump housing kind of opposite of the boost valves. As described it is held in by a pin with a ball above it.

Posted from the TurboBuick.Com mobile app

 

[quickt]

It is in the outer pump housing kind of opposite of the boost valves. As described it is held in by a pin with a ball above it.

Posted from the TurboBuick.Com mobile app

Correct!! You cant access it with the pump in the transmission. Must be out on the bench. I will see if I can get you a pic.

 

[quickt]

Here is a Pic I grabbed off the net. You can see the location just below his little finger. That spring can break on the tip or can just get weak.

 

[Steve V]

Great info thanks.

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[McHaggis]

Not meaning to hijack this thread but........
Two things....
When the spring breaks and allows more oil to bypass can this cause oil to spray out the vent tube, particularly after a high speed pass?
Is it likely that a buzzing pump will cause the ball under the broken pressure relief spring to pound out the seat in the pump housing? And is this fixable or is a new pump the only fix?
Yes, my pump was buzzing like crazy too and the end coil was broken off the spring.

 

[quickt]

Not meaning to hijack this thread but........
Two things....
When the spring breaks and allows more oil to bypass can this cause oil to spray out the vent tube, particularly after a high speed pass?
Is it likely that a buzzing pump will cause the ball under the broken pressure relief spring to pound out the seat in the pump housing? And is this fixable or is a new pump the only fix?
Yes, my pump was buzzing like crazy too and the end coil was broken off the spring.

Yes the relief points directly at the OD clutch shield and can deflect oil directly into the vent area. I have not seen the seat hurt before. The more common problem is the spring loosing install height and relieving at a lower pressure. Even a relief pressure change as low as 250psi can be a problem. I had a post about this problem here on the board back in 08 or 09. Not to put a sales hat on but I have 330lb Max pressure springs, not sure if they are up on the website yet. I replace them all, I don't bother to check them.

 

[McHaggis]

Here's a pics of mine. Looks like seats damage?

http://i1211.photobucket.com/albums/cc424/69mchaggis69/144afb1288ea25e4fd904a745204e64a.jpg

 

[quickt]

Here's a pics of mine. Looks like seats damage?

http://i1211.photobucket.com/albums/cc424/69mchaggis69/144afb1288ea25e4fd904a745204e64a.jpg

The seat that the ball seals on is the lower seat in the picture. The upper portion guides the ball to stay on the spring. That guide area does appear damaged. With a new spring and its length I do not believe that area would come into play. I would test the pump and if it seals and relieves ok, its usable. Keep in mind that area only comes into play to keep pressure in check. Its not constantly bypassing.

 

[David Husek]

When the max pressure spring breaks you will find pieces of the spring in the pan. SEE PIC. The spring will dig into the retaining pin most times and break the spring. I install a washer on top of the spring to reduce the chance of breakage and increase pressure.. The max pressure spring Lonnie has works well also and I use them on builds that require a lot of pressure.

When the spring breaks you will usually get a loud buzz from 2800 to 4000 RPM and then it will go away. Not always the case, but it will indicate you broke this spring.

I recently had a customer send me a video of his trans that had a 10" converter and it made the same noise. It ended up being the converter eating itself. Every time he touched the TV it would have that noise. The trans and converter worked fine still. The pressures where not steady. The trans did not have any metal or damage, but the converter when drained had lots of debris. This may not be your problem, but it does sound very similar.

I would pull the pan and see what you find

.

 

[TexasT]

Great Tech. Thanks to all for posting.

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[Janis Transmission]

You guys are probably right on the money but 1 problem I had with a buzzing noise is the t.v. limit valve was stuck causing excessive line pressure because it feeds the throttle valve T.V. and recieves oil directly from the pump . 1 problem i had.

 

[VIN7]

The transmission whines very loudly, it has since I put it in with two different convertors, it was gone through twice, no difference. When the car isn't moving is there anything in the transmission that is moving? If not then it has to be the pump, correct? The whine is present in all gears. If I put it in gear and stand on the brakes and raise the rpm the whine gets louder. Pressures are great now that I seated the filter seals that are used with Bruce's shallow pan. Just this loud whine and buzzing at part throttle shifts. Dropped the pan, no metal, no broken parts of a spring.

Headphones are needed to hear the whine and shift buzz. Video is poor because it is much louder in the car.

This is getting old and I need to find a solution before I go crazy.

 

[Ed Valvo]

What was the solution?