GN1 R or TA aluminum ported head flow numbers

Mr.Spool

Well-Known Member
I like talking about this stuff, so it is meant for discussion. I also understand it takes a lot more to build a fast car. So consider it in that context.
i understand.theory can be fun but the hard truth of things are parts usually break when trying to maximize say a turbo.several of us have overspeed compressors to the point of breaking billet wheels.if you want to go fast and last longer a combo that utilizes most of the turbos capability but not all of it is the way to go.there is more to it than just back pressure and alot of guys think thats a bad thing but i have seen some really fast cars with more than 2/1 bp.
 

gunzandgearz

gearzandgunz
Yep 100% about matching the whole combination, decide how fast you want to go and picking all the right parts that match combination is everything turbo included there's guys that have flown with 3to1pressure ratios but sure is nice with these new turbos alo:pt easier to get one to one nowadays
 

Mr.Spool

Well-Known Member
the turbine is able to extract much more energy from the exhaust then you are using to pump it(possible to do much better, but you would lose too much turbine response).
if the turbine response is lost its not extracting more from the exhaust its actually less or not enough exhaust to drive the turbine wheel,this is why compression really helps as it get the turbo moving and making power.
 

Mr.Spool

Well-Known Member
Yep 100% about matching the whole combination, decide how fast you want to go and picking all the right parts that match combination is everything turbo included there's guys that have flown with 3to1pressure ratios but sure is nice with these new turbos alo:pt easier to get one to one nowadays
yup:)there are many ways to go fast
 

gunzandgearz

gearzandgunz
soon very soon:)the sweepers need to sweep;)
by the way good answer on the turbo compressor map here's some more good food for thought a lot of people think that increasing boost increases ve of the engine when in all reality what's really happening is the v/e doesn't actually change youare just stuffing more air mass into the engine
 

Mike T

Well-Known Member
It is an opinion on my part, because I certainly do not have the coin to test it all out. I like talking about this stuff, so it is meant for discussion. I also understand it takes a lot more to build a fast car. So consider it in that context.


Nigel I enjoyed the entire post but this portion really hit home for me. Lack of funds is certainly no fun ….ask me how I know:rolleyes:.

I've never had a "lot" of disposable income to spend on the car and honestly that's always bothered me. However there is a silver lining or an upside to being broke, it forces you to learn and make due with whatever parts you can scrape up. I've even salvaged rear main seals just to get back on the road:oops:. Being broke forces you to get out there and do it because you can't pay someone else to do it for you.

In the end you are a much smarter person with experience that money CAN'T buy.

When your "financial ship" does come in you'll be deadly
 

Nigel

Well-Known Member
Nigel I enjoyed the entire post but this portion really hit home for me. Lack of funds is certainly no fun ….ask me how I know:rolleyes:.

I've never had a "lot" of disposable income to spend on the car and honestly that's always bothered me. However there is a silver lining or an upside to being broke, it forces you to learn and make due with whatever parts you can scrape up. I've even salvaged rear main seals just to get back on the road:oops:. Being broke forces you to get out there and do it because you can't pay someone else to do it for you.

In the end you are a much smarter person with experience that money CAN'T buy.

When your "financial ship" does come in you'll be deadly
Thanks Mike. I'm getting there. I don't mind being on a budget, because I have kids to get through school. Once I have money it means my kids are out on there own and I am old. So it will be a double edge sword. Hopefully in about two months or so I will be back up and running.:)
 

johnplogii

Senior citizen
I believe we have found the limit of the stock head casting. The deck appears to be flexing, at least in the back half of the track due to the thickness or lack of. We could probably go a little further with a fresh set of heads, but at least with this pair, 8.70’s is it. The last pass was looking like high 8.60’s/low 8.70’s, it went 8.78 losing a head gasket at 1000ft. At 8.80’s/8.90’s it held together for a couple years. That’s all I have to share on what the stock iron heads can do.
 

Mr.Spool

Well-Known Member
The deck appears to be flexing,
its very hard/ maybe impossible to figure out for sure if this is truly happening.in this power range/et range on a 109 we are seeing all the casting weaknesses.we have seen that everything is moving around big time.cracked cylinders is what we are seeing,and there seems to be no way to stop that,besides a better block.hurting a head could be from the amount of heat cycles,to the over milling of the head when it comes off,prolonged extreme cylinder pressure and the list goes on.on way you could try to tell is get another pair and try them or put an aluminum head on with a stronger deck on the same motor and see,but from what we have seen its really the block thats needs more strength.there really is a point where you get alot of time with a 109 and where it will break very fast i believe your at that point.
 

johnplogii

Senior citizen
its very hard/ maybe impossible to figure out for sure if this is truly happening.in this power range/et range on a 109 we are seeing all the casting weaknesses.we have seen that everything is moving around big time.cracked cylinders is what we are seeing,and there seems to be no way to stop that,besides a better block.hurting a head could be from the amount of heat cycles,to the over milling of the head when it comes off,prolonged extreme cylinder pressure and the list goes on.on way you could try to tell is get another pair and try them or put an aluminum head on with a stronger deck on the same motor and see,but from what we have seen its really the block thats needs more strength.there really is a point where you get alot of time with a 109 and where it will break very fast i believe your at that point.
We got past the cracking cylinder walls about 4 years ago. Been through much trial and error to get to where we did with the stock configuration drive train.
 
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