Fastest Hot Air track times?

NY Twin Turbo

All the good stuff.....Times 2.
#2
Back in the day......

Marka Gallina, John's wife held an NHRA record with a hot-air set-up. I believe it was mid 11's in the early 1990's. It was a factory-spec type class similar to the FAST series today. That means it was all stock parts massaged to death.

Is there anyone out there who remembers the details? Or have I been doing Buicks too long.
 

charlief1

RIP Charlie!
#3
So far there are several in the low 10's and we've been waiting for a couple of years for one of them to get in the 9's. You won't get a lot of info on how they did it since once you get to a certain point, you don't want to give your secrets away.:D There's even 1 B4blcak car in the 11's now.:eek:
 

NY Twin Turbo

All the good stuff.....Times 2.
#5
Thats cool that there are some that fast, if I had the money I would make mine the fastest it could be!
It shouldn't be too hard these days. Engine management is faster and better. E-85 and Alky-injection helps. Basically build 9 second car the same way you build an intercooled car. Then just subtract the intercooler! What's the big deal? You don't need a 50 lb piece of aluminum hanging off the front of the car anyway.

The trick is using the factory block and set-up. But why bother. The 86/87 guys don't use factory anything (except for the block) to run 9's. So use a 109 block and run 9's too. I'm convinced if I plumbed my turbos dirrectly to my throttle body and bypassed the cooler it would still go 9's. And funny thing....my car is an 85 T-Type with an 85 stage motor!

You don't need an intercooler. Fact is........You still need everything else.
 

NY Twin Turbo

All the good stuff.....Times 2.
#7
i think a mostly stock car that is tuned and refined is a 12 second car, which is actually pretty quick for a street car.
Yes. I agree. If you run 12.0 or close it's still a quick car. But if you wan't to call it "quick" when you talk to your other "Hot-Rod" friends it should be able to do it at any time, for any reason, with pump-gas, street pressure in the tires, with your girlfriend or mother driving, from any traffic light, on any day, at any temperature, with a passenger, on any street! Because these days that is what you need to keep-up with the new stuff that's being sold to the public.

To do that, you may have to build an 11.0 car or faster. If it can do that........Then it is quick by anyone's standards! And I don't believe you would ever fail to impress anyone.
 

NY Twin Turbo

All the good stuff.....Times 2.
#10
Yes. I agree. If you run 12.0 or close it's still a quick car. But if you wan't to call it "quick" when you talk to your other "Hot-Rod" friends it should be able to do it at any time, for any reason, with pump-gas, street pressure in the tires, with your girlfriend or mother driving, from any traffic light, on any day, at any temperature, with a passenger, on any street! Because these days that is what you need to keep-up with the new stuff that's being sold to the public.

To do that, you may have to build an 11.0 car or faster. If it can do that........Then it is quick by anyone's standards! And I don't believe you would ever fail to impress anyone.
Yes, you are correct. And any car you buy from the dealership that runs 12.0 or better will cost you more. More to own, more to insure, more to maintain........The only thing you won't get more of is looking, staring, and pointing from on-lookers. I wouldn't trade my car for a Bugatti. And I know I could build a car I like better with less than a 1/2 million. Even a GTR owner can go F*ck himself in the ear. And that piece of sh*t is 1/10th the cost of a Bugatti. Even with a possible 100k into my car.....I'm still ahead of the game!

F*ck them all!............BUICKS FOREVER!!!!!!!!:woot::woot::woot:
 

novaderrik

Well-Known Member
#11
Yes. I agree. If you run 12.0 or close it's still a quick car. But if you wan't to call it "quick" when you talk to your other "Hot-Rod" friends it should be able to do it at any time, for any reason, with pump-gas, street pressure in the tires, with your girlfriend or mother driving, from any traffic light, on any day, at any temperature, with a passenger, on any street! Because these days that is what you need to keep-up with the new stuff that's being sold to the public.

To do that, you may have to build an 11.0 car or faster. If it can do that........Then it is quick by anyone's standards! And I don't believe you would ever fail to impress anyone.

too bad i don't give a crap what other people think and i most definitely aint trying to impress anyone.. a 12 second car feels plenty fast to me, and i'll give up all out speed for comfort and reliability since i like to be able to jump in my car and drive it anywhere, any time and i can't afford to pay a tow truck to drag my car home 500 miles when something breaks..
 

NY Twin Turbo

All the good stuff.....Times 2.
#12
too bad i don't give a crap what other people think and i most definitely aint trying to impress anyone.. a 12 second car feels plenty fast to me, and i'll give up all out speed for comfort and reliability since i like to be able to jump in my car and drive it anywhere, any time and i can't afford to pay a tow truck to drag my car home 500 miles when something breaks..
No doubt. I didn't say you should. But remember if you wan't to keep up with the newer factory fast cars, you can. Even with a Hot-Air Buick. And you can still have it reliable and still do it cheaper then buying one of theirs. Just a little pep talk. Keep that in mind if someone gives you crap about your old hot-air Buick.
 

novaderrik

Well-Known Member
#13
one thing about hot air Buicks: well, mine at least... while it wasn't terribly fast, it was awesomely consistent when i had it at the track on a friday night grudge race night. i made about 10 passes, and there wasn't more than a couple of hundredths of spread between the fastest and slowest passes, and some of that might have been from inconsistent staging because i didn't really put that much effort into it. if the trans wouldn't have blown on the last pass, i was seriously considering doing some bracket racing with it- which means that if that consistency held and i learned how to stage and leave the line consistently, i would have killed many faster cars with it..
 

SloGN

I'm a ASSHOLE.....
#14
It shouldn't be too hard these days. Engine management is faster and better. E-85 and Alky-injection helps. Basically build 9 second car the same way you build an intercooled car. Then just subtract the intercooler! What's the big deal? You don't need a 50 lb piece of aluminum hanging off the front of the car anyway.

The trick is using the factory block and set-up. But why bother. The 86/87 guys don't use factory anything (except for the block) to run 9's. So use a 109 block and run 9's too. I'm convinced if I plumbed my turbos dirrectly to my throttle body and bypassed the cooler it would still go 9's. And funny thing....my car is an 85 T-Type with an 85 stage motor!

You don't need an intercooler. Fact is........You still need everything else.

There are several 109 iron headed stock stroked stock intake doghouse i/c cars in the nines....take a look at the tai section and you will see them

So they are using more than just the block..

Not saying there won't be a nine second hot air..but it's not anywhere as easy as a I/c car..and that's not a very easy task either...


Not stepping on toes just pointing out facts

Pat broughton
 

NY Twin Turbo

All the good stuff.....Times 2.
#15
There are several 109 iron headed stock stroked stock intake doghouse i/c cars in the nines....take a look at the tai section and you will see them

So they are using more than just the block..

Not saying there won't be a nine second hot air..but it's not anywhere as easy as a I/c car..and that's not a very easy task either...


Not stepping on toes just pointing out facts

Pat broughton
I'm not sure but I think you just said the same thing as I did. I know there are a lot of 109's in the 9's. I knew this long before I was a member of this forum and I definitely don't need to read anything in this forum to be convinced that this is happening.

So, the question is what defines a hot-air set-up?

If leaving the intercooler out is the only defining factor.......then yes. Technically, It shouldn't be too hard these days..... Simple actually. Nothing innovative has to be done. We all know the combination of parts to build a 9 second car. This is no mystery.

Step 1- Secure funding. This is the ONLY hard part.

Step 2- Build a low 9 second car and leave out the intercooler. Re-tune. Run E-85 or M-1 and go high 9's. Done.

The only real mystery for most of us is the Step-1 part.

Now.......If you define a Hot-air set-up as needing an 84/85 block, then we agree. The tech may still need some development. So even money won't make it easy.

What facts have you pointed out that somehow I didn't already agree with?
Again, I'll be more clear with my final sentence from my quoted post.

You don't need an intercooler in an 84/85 car to run 9's. Fact is...........you still need everything else that the 86/87 need to do it.
 

Boost231

What's An Intercooler
Staff member
#16
I've made over 600hp to the rear tires at 20lbs on a hot air setup. Did some test at the track but never pushed it down the whole quarter. Drove it on the street a lot and played. Still have some issues running it with air Temps and egts. It can be done and I've done it. I'm changing setups again and probably won't push more the 600hp again in a hot air setup
 

SloGN

I'm a ASSHOLE.....
#17
I'm not sure but I think you just said the same thing as I did. I know there are a lot of 109's in the 9's. I knew this long before I was a member of this forum and I definitely don't need to read anything in this forum to be convinced that this is happening.

So, the question is what defines a hot-air set-up?

If leaving the intercooler out is the only defining factor.......then yes. Technically, It shouldn't be too hard these days..... Simple actually. Nothing innovative has to be done. We all know the combination of parts to build a 9 second car. This is no mystery.

Step 1- Secure funding. This is the ONLY hard part.

Step 2- Build a low 9 second car and leave out the intercooler. Re-tune. Run E-85 or M-1 and go high 9's. Done.

The only real mystery for most of us is the Step-1 part.

Now.......If you define a Hot-air set-up as needing an 84/85 block, then we agree. The tech may still need some development. So even money won't make it easy.

What facts have you pointed out that somehow I didn't already agree with?
Again, I'll be more clear with my final sentence from my quoted post.

You don't need an intercooler in an 84/85 car to run 9's. Fact is...........you still need everything else that the 86/87 need to do it.

I'm not defining a hot air based on just the block ...

I'm basing it on the entire set up in its current form. The turbo location stock intake manifold (ported/gutted whatever) .. this is what I'm defining ...

Now your may be talking about a race car setup 86-87 and just yanking the intercooler off and thus it's now a hot air....I don't see it that way..

I also don't know of any form of turbo cars buicks that's in the nines without a intercooler using non stage 2 parts...

The biggest problem is the heat and alky injection can only do so much before it's saturated the air and chokes out the engine..I dunno about the e85 stuff but I'm sure it can only remove so much heat before it too saturates the air and chokes out the engine .


It gonna take a much larger turbo than needed for a I/c just singly can get the same airflow at a lower pressure to help reduce the heat.

Air being compressed adds about 11 degrees for every 1 psi ..
 

NY Twin Turbo

All the good stuff.....Times 2.
#18
I'm not defining a hot air based on just the block ...

I'm basing it on the entire set up in its current form. The turbo location stock intake manifold (ported/gutted whatever) .. this is what I'm defining ...

Now your may be talking about a race car setup 86-87 and just yanking the intercooler off and thus it's now a hot air....I don't see it that way..

I also don't know of any form of turbo cars buicks that's in the nines without a intercooler using non stage 2 parts...

The biggest problem is the heat and alky injection can only do so much before it's saturated the air and chokes out the engine..I dunno about the e85 stuff but I'm sure it can only remove so much heat before it too saturates the air and chokes out the engine .


It gonna take a much larger turbo than needed for a I/c just singly can get the same airflow at a lower pressure to help reduce the heat.

Air being compressed adds about 11 degrees for every 1 psi ..
I may have seen the original question as overly simplified. I also agree with you on this one. If it needs to "look like" and have the same block as 84/85 it would be very difficult.

But, if had the ambition and money this is what I would do..........

-I would have a bad-ass 109 motor built. Forged crank, pistons, rods/caps and girdle/aluminum heads/big roller cam/stroked/electric water pump/Duttweiler oiling system........all the good stuff.

-Design and have fabricated a bad-ass sheet metal intake that feeds from the top and back of the motor. Make it's appearance reminiscent of the factory one.Then I would stick a hot-air Turbo-6 emblem on it.:D

-Put a big turbo on top of that with a 90mm throttlebody before the turbo.

-Run a big-ass pump, regulator and injectors spraying strait M-1 into the runners. I may even put alky injection pre-turbo just for good measure.No gasoline. Intake temps may be below ambient!!

-Custom headers.

-XFI engine management with coil-on plug ignition.

-Drop the whole set-up in my car (which happens to be an 85 T-Type ;)) after I remove the intercooler.

-Run 9's.:smug:

Now, why argue and say that's not an 84/85 set-up? I never heard of anyone argue with intercooled guys running the same kind of after-market stuff as this and tell them "that's not an 86/87 set-up!" It's really the same thing.

It certainly will "look like" a hot-air car more then a hot-air car with an intercooler. If it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck.......then it must be a duck!
 
#19
I have mine with a ta 33 into the high 11's and still tuning... stock housing turbo, stock but ported intake, champion iron heads, stock block,, E85 and meth.