Comp Cams 980 spring questions...

J Banning

Quench my thirst with C16
A couple of questions regarding the Comp Cams 980 valve springs...

1. Should I re-install the factory spring-cups?

2. If I use the factory spring cups, should I use the provided spring dampeners as well?

3. Are there ANY differences between the sets of 12 and the sets of 16 that they sell (980-12 vs. 980-16)?

4. Where can I get extra keepers? I've heard several people suggest that I get extras to keep on hand when I'm doing the job.

Thanks,
-Banning.
 

buickboy

Active Member
1. Do not re-use the stock cups, alters seat pressure above 91 lbs

2. Leave the CC dampeners in the springs.

3. No difference in the springs except the quantity in the box.

4. I have a ton of good keepers. Send me a SASE and i will send you 6 keepers.

I would strongly suggest new rocker shafts and rocker nylon buttons as well as valve stem seals on the intake side only. Any speed shop or parts store should be able to get the rocker shafts cheap

email me private for my address
Mitch
 

87LtdT

Active Member
I agree 100% with Buickboy and would add that if you do elect to re-use the spring cups they will act as shims and add about 9 pounds of spring load to the advertised numbers (.030" thick shim times 307 psi spring rate.)

Not needed for our relatively slow spinning engines in my humble opinion.

Regards, Bob
 

J Banning

Quench my thirst with C16
Thanks for the reply guys.

I believe Red Armstrong recommends that the stock spring retainer be kept in place with these springs. Interesting that you guys are saying not to. I've also found more mixed opinions in another older, but somewhat related post:
http://www.turbobuick.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=8782&highlight=980

Mitch: I just found someone local that has spare keepers I can use if needed. I appreciate the offer though, thanks.

Thanks again,
-Banning.
 

87GN_70GS

Active Member
Remember that the cup will also increase the solid heighth by 0.030" as well. This reduces the max cam lift you can run by 0.030". If you have a stock cam then you're fine, If you change cams, just dont go above 0.460" lift (1.7 - (1.15+0.03+0.06)), assuming that installed height is 1.700".
 

MSDGN

Active Member
I believe Red recommends if you use the stock cups to remove the internal dampers for the 980's and if you decide to leave the internal dampeners in then don't use the cups...if you are using a stock cam I would remove the dampeners and use the stock cups...the stock cup does act as a shim and with a stock cam will keep the valve train geometry intact...JMO...
 

J Banning

Quench my thirst with C16
I just realized that I don't have the stock spring cups (duh), so I'll be installing the 980's with the spring dampeners that came with them.

- Banning.
 

J Banning

Quench my thirst with C16
I got the springs in , and the car is running once again!

I did not use the stock springs cups (didn't have them), and I used the spring dampeners that came with the comp cam springs. The total job took about 2 hours.

A couple questions now that the car is running again...

1. Prior to the spring replacement, my 1/2 & 2/3 shift points were very high at about 5100rpm (in drive). Now, they're much lower... 4600 for the 1/2, and about 4700 for the 2/3. I'll re-adjust my TV cable and see what happens. What would the cause of this be? Could my old springs have been that shot? Will these new springs break in/loosen up a little in the next few weeks?

2. In addition to the change in shift points, it appears that my O2 millivots (on scanmaster) have gone up some. I'd say they're probably about 10 points higher than before. Can some one explain this? Obviously it has something to do with the spring replacement, but why?

Note: I'll get some runs this week recorded with the Directscan, and will be able to tell for sure what's going on with the car. For now though, I'd say that it feels really good!

Some observations after doing the spring job...

1. Get the Kirban tool!! This thing was a life saver. In addition to the Kirban tool, I also had a on-the-car spring compressor. It's a nice tool, but the Kirban tool can fit into the much tighter spaces on our car. If the heads were off the car, I'd use the on-the-car spring compressor instead.

2. Make sure you have extra valve keepers. I didn't loose any, but can see how easy it would be to do so. Read on....

3. Make sure you have a small telescoping magnet (from craftsman, etc.), to get the valve keepers out with. If I didn't have one of these, I probably would of dropped half of them down onto the crossmember!

4. Get a bunch of large bolts to drop in the pushrod & oil drain holes. Then you won't have to worry about anything falling in there. It's a lot easier than having to stuff paper towels in there. Plus the bolt head will keep them from falling in. No worries.

That's it. I appreciate all the advice.
-Banning.
 

Turbosix6

PORSCHE KILLER
So , whatever happened after testing?? did you figure out why the shift points dropped?

I am considering replacing my valve springs - what is the spring of choice??
 
sorry to revive this super old thread, but this is almost my same question so no sense in starting another.

if someone bought 980 springs and wished they had gone 981, would using the stock spring cup along with the 980 inner dampeners be ok? figured that would bump the stiffness close to the 981s?

stock cam, but will be pushing a 6262 on E85
 

earlbrown

runs with scissors
sorry to revive this super old thread, but this is almost my same question so no sense in starting another.

if someone bought 980 springs and wished they had gone 981, would using the stock spring cup along with the 980 inner dampeners be ok? figured that would bump the stiffness close to the 981s?

stock cam, but will be pushing a 6262 on E85
the only way to know is to measure your exact spring installed height, then put your exact springs in a spring tester.


ANYTHING else you hear is a wild ass guess.
 

dank GN

BlackArts Automotive (661)993-8277
I personally would go with the 981 . They have alil more seat pressure and with the 980 if you saw what the seat pressure ends up being after acouple heat cycles I’m pretty sure you would go with the 981s aswell .
 
the only way to know is to measure your exact spring installed height, then put your exact springs in a spring tester.


ANYTHING else you hear is a wild ass guess.
i agree. tbh i didn't plan on doing any of that as i do not have the tools or the knowledge. the motor is all stock internally except for a new double roller. goal was to run it all out until the motor lets go. I have the 980's that i was gonna put in, did some more reading and arrived at this thread.

if you were to take a wild ass guess, would there be any problem in using the stock spring cup along with the 980 inner dampeners?
 

1KWIKSIX

Well-Known Member
You don't "guess" with this stuff.
Suggest you Contact Bison with your goals and have him supply valve springs already measured and set up to your specs. You will need to have a valve spring micrometer and shims handy to ensure the springs are installed at the correct height.
 

earlbrown

runs with scissors
i agree. tbh i didn't plan on doing any of that as i do not have the tools or the knowledge. the motor is all stock internally except for a new double roller. goal was to run it all out until the motor lets go. I have the 980's that i was gonna put in, did some more reading and arrived at this thread.

if you were to take a wild ass guess, would there be any problem in using the stock spring cup along with the 980 inner dampeners?
If it's truely ''all stock'', you've got a mess. The stock springs are so poor, they were weak when your car was sitting at the dealership, brand new.


...and if that new double roller was installed with the tensioner in place, you'll be going back in there very soon.


I'd recommend doing the repairs correctly and being done with it. Every cylinder head machine shop has a spring tester.
 
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