SO I have a spare intercooler and want to try this myself as a test. Think I could switch to an electric fan and place the stock '86/'87 IC in the stock location by just clocking the turbo and using some creative routing? Doesn't look to be too hard. Any thoughts on this? If I can get it to work, I'll finalise next year with a Dutt. neck and ported intake and heads. What do you suppose a stock IC would net you power or E.T. wise? Should help in the blistering-hot weather we've been having.
Anyone think of trying this?
- Thread starter mike85gn
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EyeTalk2Trees
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- May 29, 2001
If I'm picturing this correct it sounds like most of the IC Kits that are sold for the Hotairs. Only you have a stock IC which is smaller but heck I'd throw one on if I had an extra one laying around. Sure won't create any power under a pile of stuff in my garage. GO FOR IT!! sounds like a fun project.
Hey Mike, that sounds like it would work pretty good to me! Only think you would have to really worry about it where to route the piping and how. But other than that it would work. All you need to do is get the mounting brackets for the intercooler, and you might have to modify the intercooler necks somewhat. And just make sure that the piping is sealed good, any leaks will cause poor idling if the TB will remain on the turbo. hope that's some insight!
-Todders
-Todders
You would need to get an IC shroud and ducting like what the 86/7s have to get the cool air from in front of the radiator to the IC and also with the shroud to keep the hot air from the rad from getting to the IC...
With an electric radiator fan in place, run the piping from the back of the intake(If you will still be using the stock intake). turn towards the front of the car before you get to the brake master cylinder(so the piping is between the motor and the steering shaft/brake booster), and finish it off to the IC, then out of the IC straight to the top of the motor to the turbo...
You will need the adapter for the intake/piping and the adapter plate for when you re-clock the turbo so that the TB can stay straight and level...Otherwise your TPS will sit up too high and wear a hole in the hoodliner...(Don't ask how I know!!!
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With an electric radiator fan in place, run the piping from the back of the intake(If you will still be using the stock intake). turn towards the front of the car before you get to the brake master cylinder(so the piping is between the motor and the steering shaft/brake booster), and finish it off to the IC, then out of the IC straight to the top of the motor to the turbo...
You will need the adapter for the intake/piping and the adapter plate for when you re-clock the turbo so that the TB can stay straight and level...Otherwise your TPS will sit up too high and wear a hole in the hoodliner...(Don't ask how I know!!!
)Well, Spearco's insturctions basically gave me the routing ideas, but instead of a front mount, I'll stick it in front of the motor. Or maybe I'll do a FM, but I'll use a stock IC and just stick it in upside down and run the piping under the rad. Get rid of those crappy necks too, do a Duttweiler-like job on it. Stock intake will be retained, but it will be hollowed out like an open plenum for some more flow. Maybe I'll do headwork too. But I'm really lazy so you never know.
I HAD THE SAME IDEA ! AFTER CAREFUL THOUGHT , I AM STILL GOING TO PURSUE IT. SPEARCO INCREASE THE COST OF THEIR KIT TO $1250 . THE KIT IS GOOD, BUT NOT THAT DAMN GOOD . I LOVE WHAT FJM568 DID WITH HIS CONVERSION . WITH TURBOMOTION CLOSED DOWN, I WOULD HOPE SOMEONE WOULD STEPUP AND HELP THE CAUSE. I COULD SEE THE MERIT OF USING A 86-87 INTAKE (AND CREATING A OUTLET SIMILAR TO THE ONE USED BY FJM568). I ALSO CAN SEE AND HAVE BLUEPRINTED A 86-87 INTAKE WITH A OUTLET THAT HOOKS BACK TO THE RECLOCKED TURBO. I HAVE A INTEREST IN PUTTING A INTERCOOLER THE INTAKE (IN THIS CASE, A HEAT CORE IN A 86-87 INTAKE AND INJECTING CO2, NITROUS, PROPANE, OR FREON). I AM LOOKING AT ALL POSSIBILITIES ( RUNNING HOT AIR / METHANOL [COOLS LIKES A INTERCOOLER] LIKE INDY V6'S). I HAVE A COUPLE OF STOCK INTERCOOLER AND HAD PLANNED TO PUT ONE IN THE STOP LOCATION. I AM LOOKING CUTTING THE STOCK INTAKE AND PUTTING A INLET ABOVE THE WATER INLET IN FRONT OF INTAKE. OR ROTATING THE TURBO FORWARD AND HOOKING BACK INTO THE FRONT OF THE INTAKE. JUST SOME IDEAS I HAVE HAD .
CHUCK
! AFTER CAREFUL THOUGHT , I AM STILL GOING TO PURSUE IT. SPEARCO INCREASE THE COST OF THEIR KIT TO $1250 . THE KIT IS GOOD, BUT NOT THAT DAMN GOOD . I LOVE WHAT FJM568 DID WITH HIS CONVERSION . WITH TURBOMOTION CLOSED DOWN, I WOULD HOPE SOMEONE WOULD STEPUP AND HELP THE CAUSE. I COULD SEE THE MERIT OF USING A 86-87 INTAKE (AND CREATING A OUTLET SIMILAR TO THE ONE USED BY FJM568). I ALSO CAN SEE AND HAVE BLUEPRINTED A 86-87 INTAKE WITH A OUTLET THAT HOOKS BACK TO THE RECLOCKED TURBO. I HAVE A INTEREST IN PUTTING A INTERCOOLER THE INTAKE (IN THIS CASE, A HEAT CORE IN A 86-87 INTAKE AND INJECTING CO2, NITROUS, PROPANE, OR FREON). I AM LOOKING AT ALL POSSIBILITIES ( RUNNING HOT AIR / METHANOL [COOLS LIKES A INTERCOOLER] LIKE INDY V6'S). I HAVE A COUPLE OF STOCK INTERCOOLER AND HAD PLANNED TO PUT ONE IN THE STOP LOCATION. I AM LOOKING CUTTING THE STOCK INTAKE AND PUTTING A INLET ABOVE THE WATER INLET IN FRONT OF INTAKE. OR ROTATING THE TURBO FORWARD AND HOOKING BACK INTO THE FRONT OF THE INTAKE. JUST SOME IDEAS I HAVE HAD .CHUCK
Before I did my setup the way it is now(87 lower intake w/ a custom upper plenum and many, many little PITA mods to get it to work), I thought about staying hotair, and running the turbo reclocked and blowing down into the intake from the top, but the air distribution just wouldn't be right...The rear cylinders would not be getting much airflow because of where the turbo would be discharging at the front of the intake...And to tell the truth, I sometimes wonder how well my design even works...I did not and still don't have access to a flow bench to find out what the distribution is like...Heck, I may be leaning out the back two cylinders and melting my pistons and wouldn't even know it(when the car is running)...
The beauty of the TM V2 setup is that it was flowed and ported...Also, the TM setup sat down on the motor lower and didn't have hood clearance problems...My setup is actually rubbing the hood insulator because of the height of the plenum I made and the IC pipes stacked on top of each other...Another reason not to do what I've done...
I would love to bolt my custom plenum to an intake and have the flow distribution mapped out just to see what it comes out to be...
Who knows, maybe in the future, if ever I switch to the FAST ecm setup and dial in the injs, I would be able to find out which inj needs more pw and which needs less to even out the cyls...Without a flow bench or a way to check distribution, that would be the only way to do it...
Due to cam problems and other nagging setup difficulties and some slight modifications to it, I haven't been able to drive the car for a LONG time...But soon, .........stay tuned!!!
The beauty of the TM V2 setup is that it was flowed and ported...Also, the TM setup sat down on the motor lower and didn't have hood clearance problems...My setup is actually rubbing the hood insulator because of the height of the plenum I made and the IC pipes stacked on top of each other...Another reason not to do what I've done...
I would love to bolt my custom plenum to an intake and have the flow distribution mapped out just to see what it comes out to be...
Who knows, maybe in the future, if ever I switch to the FAST ecm setup and dial in the injs, I would be able to find out which inj needs more pw and which needs less to even out the cyls...Without a flow bench or a way to check distribution, that would be the only way to do it...
Due to cam problems and other nagging setup difficulties and some slight modifications to it, I haven't been able to drive the car for a LONG time...But soon, .........stay tuned!!!
Yeah, I was really hoping to avoid a lot of the small problems. All I really want to do is go with an electric fan and reclock the turbo, then route piping to the front and am thinking of a modified stock intercooler going in upside down (routing under the rad) and having the IC plumbing run back into the intake like the Spearco kit. The other mods are not that hard, the intake, well, a lot of people have had good results with doing some work inside by removing the bottom and cutting out some of the metal. I need to do heads anyways because I need new valve springs, seals, and guides, so I'm going to do a mild polish/cleanup as well. Add a double roller timing chain and some new gaskets all around, and I'm hoping for some strong performance and 12's at the track without breaking a sweat or a headgasket. My goal of 12's on 20/20 (20 psi boost, 20º timing) with good gas should be possible, no? Don't want to have to cram 25psi into her just to run 12's.
You plans sound fairly right on target...The only thing I would do differently is forget about the double roller timing chain...Get yourself an aftermarket all steel replacement chain and use the tensioner...Your timing will be more consistant...The double rollers tend to stretch and without using a tensioner, the timing becomes erratic...You would not believe how far those do stretch...
Which turbo are you planning on using???
You're biggest problem is going to be finding the adapters for the IC plumbing to the intake...Wasn't there some type of billet piece that was going to get made to replace the stock turbo to intake adapter...What you need needs to be one of those with a IC pipe tig'd to it...The biggest problem is the size of the adapter vs the hole in the intake along with the size of the IC pipe...The IC tubing needs to be about 2 1/2"...One way around this little problem is to take the intake to a machine shop and have the inlet hole on the intake modified in some way so that there won't be a bottleneck right there...I'm going to have to take a look at my spare intake to see what is involved in making something work...There is not a lot of room back there with the turbo right there and the firewall being very close...These cars are just a PITA to modify!!!
Damn, if only I had a milling machine here at home!!! (note to self, as soon as you get your job back and get some money saved up, BUY A MILLING MACHINE!!!)
Which turbo are you planning on using???
You're biggest problem is going to be finding the adapters for the IC plumbing to the intake...Wasn't there some type of billet piece that was going to get made to replace the stock turbo to intake adapter...What you need needs to be one of those with a IC pipe tig'd to it...The biggest problem is the size of the adapter vs the hole in the intake along with the size of the IC pipe...The IC tubing needs to be about 2 1/2"...One way around this little problem is to take the intake to a machine shop and have the inlet hole on the intake modified in some way so that there won't be a bottleneck right there...I'm going to have to take a look at my spare intake to see what is involved in making something work...There is not a lot of room back there with the turbo right there and the firewall being very close...These cars are just a PITA to modify!!!
Damn, if only I had a milling machine here at home!!!
(note to self, as soon as you get your job back and get some money saved up, BUY A MILLING MACHINE!!!) Good points there! I have a TA33 on the car with 009's for fuel, so I can support a good bit of power, I'm looking for low 12's with a 12.00 being the goal.
We're actually working around the intake adapter O-ring thingy, we're going to run some piping into the intake and have a 90º bend to hook up to the rest of the IC piping. We're just clocking the compressor housing so it points differently, there shouldn't be any problems with it being rotated 90º forward aside from making sure the throttle body and eveything clears the hood (rough measurements say it will). The ol' man says he's got something better than standard IC pipe fittings made of kevlar that he wants to try to give the system some flexibility, then we run the pipes under the rad and back up into the IC. Looks like all of the piping will be about 2.5" all the way through. So should I be ok? Or am I nuts?
We're actually working around the intake adapter O-ring thingy, we're going to run some piping into the intake and have a 90º bend to hook up to the rest of the IC piping. We're just clocking the compressor housing so it points differently, there shouldn't be any problems with it being rotated 90º forward aside from making sure the throttle body and eveything clears the hood (rough measurements say it will). The ol' man says he's got something better than standard IC pipe fittings made of kevlar that he wants to try to give the system some flexibility, then we run the pipes under the rad and back up into the IC. Looks like all of the piping will be about 2.5" all the way through. So should I be ok? Or am I nuts?
Word of advice, if you're doing all the test fitting while the engine is on an engine stand, all bets are off...Install the engine without the intake and test fit everything before finalizing your design...The is very little room in the back by the firewall when the IC pipes are run back there(If you are still keeping the stock intake inlet location)...If you're going to cut the stock intake open, then cut the top off and lower it a little bit more...About at least a half inch...I've heard that some with the Spearco setups have had to do a little grinding on the top of the intake so the turbo could clock right...
If you're not going to use the stock intake inlet, draw a sketch or something and email it to me to look at...I might be able to throw some other ideas or easier(read cheaper!!!) way to do something...
If you're not going to use the stock intake inlet, draw a sketch or something and email it to me to look at...I might be able to throw some other ideas or easier(read cheaper!!!) way to do something...
yes,you have to grind away some of the fins on the top of the intake for the spearco kit.not much,~1" square,probably 3/16" deep.i did mine with files with it on the car.one of my plans when i pull everything off to install my ported heads and cam is to have the top of the intake milled off.how thick is that aluminum on the top of the intake?could i have the top 1/4" whacked without worry?
later,sean
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