Phelps family loses in court

[IEATV8S]

Father of slain Marine wins case against foul Phelps family
By Michelle Malkin • October 31, 2007 04:12 PM

I pointed you last week to the legal case of Albert Synder, who took the foul Phelps family to court over their reprehensible protests of fallen military heroes. Snyder claimed invasion of privacy and emotional harm from the radical haters’ demonstration at his son’s funeral. Lance Cpl. Matthew Snyder died in Anbar province in a vehicle accident last year. The verdict is just in from the Baltimore Sun:

Albert Snyder of York, Pa., the father of a Westminster Marine who was killed in Iraq, today won his case in a Baltimore federal court against members of Topeka, Kan.-based Westboro Baptist Church who protested at his son’s funeral last year.

The jury of five women and four men awarded Snyder $2.9 million in compensatory damages. The amount of punitive damages to be awarded has not yet been decided. The jury deliberated for about two hours yesterday and much of today.

Snyder was the first in the nation to attempt to hold members of Westboro Baptist Church legally liable for their shock protests at military funerals after the church protested the military’s inclusion of gays at the funeral of Lance Cpl. Matthew A. Snyder, a 2003 Westminster High School graduate who died March 3, 2006, in a vehicle accident in Anbar province.

In June 2006, Snyder sued the tight-knit fundamentalist Christian church and three of its members individually. The father argued that Westboro’s demonstrations exacerbated his pain and suffering in March 2006 while he mourned the death of his only son.

Specifically, he charged that they violated his privacy, intentionally inflicted emotional harm and engaged in a conspiracy to carry out their activities. The jury decided in Snyder’s favor on every count.

The Synder website has legal documents from the case here. Send him a note of congratulations and thanks here.

Michelle Malkin » Breaking: Father of slain Marine wins case against foul Phelps family

[Weester]

Soldiers are dying in Iraq because we recognize Gays in this country???
Those wacky Christians are at it again!...................


I agree with the courts decision, but doesnt this violate "Freedom of Speech"?

[STAGE 2]

Originally Posted by Weester

Soldiers are dying in Iraq because we recognize Gays in this country???
Those wacky Christians are at it again!...................


I agree with the courts decision, but doesnt this violate "Freedom of Speech"?

1) Phelps isnt a christian. His congregation is solely made up of family members.

2) This isn't a free speech issue. There is no government action here. Even if there was, the first amendment does not protect harassment. If these folks wanted to stand on a corner and pedal there tripe thats legally fine. However going to the funerals of fallen heroes to do this is not protected as its not speech.

If there were ever people in need of a bullet these are them.

[Weester]

1. Albert Snyder of York, Pa., the father of a Westminster Marine who was killed in Iraq, today won his case in a Baltimore federal court against members of Topeka, Kan.-based Westboro Baptist Church who protested at his son’s funeral last year. Baptists are Christians!

2. The funeral was in a public place! So why cant they protest???
Again, I agree with the courts decision!

[86NYGN]

Originally Posted by Weester

1. Albert Snyder of York, Pa., the father of a Westminster Marine who was killed in Iraq, today won his case in a Baltimore federal court against members of Topeka, Kan.-based Westboro Baptist Church who protested at his son’s funeral last year. Baptists are Christians!

2. The funeral was in a public place! So why cant they protest???
Again, I agree with the courts decision!

Have no fear Weester "Perry Mason" is on the case. LOL

[G. Price]

Originally Posted by Weester

Soldiers are dying in Iraq because we recognize Gays in this country???
Those wacky Christians are at it again!...................


I agree with the courts decision, but doesnt this violate "Freedom of Speech"?

Just curious... Where did you derive your hatred for Christians?

[Weester]

"Just curious... Where did you derive your hatred for Christians?"

I dont "hate" Christians, but I do dislike "Fundamentalists"!
Anyone who condemns those who disagree with them should not be trusted!

[IEATV8S]

Originally Posted by Weester

1. Albert Snyder of York, Pa., the father of a Westminster Marine who was killed in Iraq, today won his case in a Baltimore federal court against members of Topeka, Kan.-based Westboro Baptist Church who protested at his son’s funeral last year. Baptists are Christians!

2. The funeral was in a public place! So why cant they protest???
Again, I agree with the courts decision!

Why not read the article and others on the internet for your answers!

At least you agree with the jury decision!

[IEATV8S]

Originally Posted by STAGE 2

1) Phelps isnt a christian. His congregation is solely made up of family members.

2) This isn't a free speech issue. There is no government action here. Even if there was, the first amendment does not protect harassment. If these folks wanted to stand on a corner and pedal there tripe thats legally fine. However going to the funerals of fallen heroes to do this is not protected as its not speech.

If there were ever people in need of a bullet these are them.

Hay Stage, I see you got "Hamilton Berger" on your case! No problem, Perry Mason always won his cases against Berger! LMAO!!!!!!

[slow87]

You can't use the first amendment to get out sexual harassment charges for telling your secretary she has a nice arse. They harassed him to the point of him becoming distressed, and thats what they got sued for.

Mr. Snyder should be a role model for self control. No doubt I would be facing assault charges if in the same situation.

[Weester]

Hypothetically

What about protesters that dislike a political figure, they follow him around and speak out against him, can they be sued?

[IEATV8S]

Originally Posted by Weester

Hypothetically

What about protesters that dislike a political figure, they follow him around and speak out against him, can they be sued?

Not the same, comparing apples to oranges!

[Weester]

"Not the same, comparing apples to oranges!"

Not really,

These people are Religious Fundamentalists that believe we are being punished by God because we allow "Gays". Based on their beliefs, they have gone to grave sites and protested!

Anti war activists protest all the time based on their beliefs, why cant they be sued when they protest?

A person that thinks the first amendment is "holly" will surely disagree with you!

I personally believe that there has to be "limits" on the first amendment, others will say that it is a "slippery slope" and want all speech to be allowed!
I say they are cowards, afraid to take a stand!

[STAGE 2]

Originally Posted by Weester

1. Albert Snyder of York, Pa., the father of a Westminster Marine who was killed in Iraq, today won his case in a Baltimore federal court against members of Topeka, Kan.-based Westboro Baptist Church who protested at his son’s funeral last year. Baptists are Christians!

2. The funeral was in a public place! So why cant they protest???
Again, I agree with the courts decision!

1. There is no "church". They have a name, but thats it. The only "members" are Phelps' family. These folks are not baptist. They have no affiliation with any other religious organization and certianly dont practice anything the bible teaches. I can call myself a cat, but that doesn't make me one.


2. Because not every public place is a public forum. A library is a public place, but you cant protest in the fiction section. No one is denying them their freedom of speech. They can go to any street corner they want to. They simply cannot do this at the funerals of soldiers. The first amendment doesn't protect harassment, or "fighting words" or speech intended to incite.

Prohibiting them from doing this at the funerals doesn't stop them from speaking, it stops them from harassing and inciting potential conflicts. Thats why this ins perfectly fine and why laws that place time place and manner restrictions are usually acceptable while laws regulating the content of speech are usually not.

[a trail rider]

Originally Posted by Weester

Hypothetically

What about protesters that dislike a political figure, they follow him around and speak out against him, can they be sued?

Public officials aren't protected as the average citizen is protected, so no... Can't be sued.

This group was sued based on harrassment primarily. Protesting in public, when permits are awarded, is one thing. Going from funeral to funeral and harrassing the families of the dead... Not protected as free speech because it's not free speech. Further, they were blatently slandering others without justification. That too, is illegal.

[The Blob]

First you say this...

Originally Posted by Weester

"Not the same, comparing apples to oranges!"
Not really,
Soldiers are dying in Iraq because we recognize Gays in this country???
Those wacky Christians are at it again!...................

I agree with the courts decision, but doesnt this violate "Freedom of Speech"?

Then you make the incredible leap of logic by defending them...

These people are Religious Fundamentalists that believe we are being punished by God because we allow "Gays". Based on their beliefs, they have gone to grave sites and protested!

Anti war activists protest all the time based on their beliefs, why cant they be sued when they protest?

A person that thinks the first amendment is "holly" will surely disagree with you!

I personally believe that there has to be "limits" on the first amendment, others will say that it is a "slippery slope" and want all speech to be allowed!
I say they are cowards, afraid to take a stand!

It's also quite amusing how you go out of your way to find religious whack jobs, then label them "Christians" with the specific intent to put the stink on all Christians, then claim you are not doing it.

YET... you are very quick to pull out the "anti-Semite" card.

[ZEROLAG]

Originally Posted by Weester

I agree with the courts decision, but doesnt this violate "Freedom of Speech"?

Soilders like those killed and the one's before you gave you that right of freedom of speech, as well as all your freedoms. Don't disrespect them as there being laid to rest.

[Weester]

"Soilders like those killed and the one's before you gave you that right of freedom of speech, as well as all your freedoms. Don't disrespect them as there being laid to rest."

I agree with you 100%...I think thant this decision should also apply to other fanatical groups in this country, but they hide behind the 1st amendment! There are groups in this country whos sole goal is bringing down our nation, ie: KKK, American Nazis, Muslim extremists, etc etc!

I'm not supporting what these Fundamentalists/phelps did. I was only trying to show how easy it is to hide under the 1st amendment!

[Weester]

"Then you make the incredible leap of logic by defending them..."

Whos defending them???? There are people in this country that would defend their right to protest based on the 1st amendment! Its absurd!



"It's also quite amusing how you go out of your way to find religious whack jobs, then label them "Christians" with the specific intent to put the stink on all Christians, then claim you are not doing it."

Same could be said for those who claim ALL Muslims are out to destroy all non-believers!

People who live in glass houses shouldnt throw rocks.......

[IEATV8S]

Originally Posted by Weester

"Soilders like those killed and the one's before you gave you that right of freedom of speech, as well as all your freedoms. Don't disrespect them as there being laid to rest."

I agree with you 100%...I think thant this decision should also apply to other fanatical groups in this country, but they hide behind the 1st amendment! There are groups in this country whos sole goal is bringing down our nation, ie: KKK, American Nazis, Muslim extremists, etc etc!

I'm not supporting what these Fundamentalists/phelps did. I was only trying to show how easy it is to hide under the 1st amendment!

You forgot a few other fanatical groups, the ACLU, MORON.Org, Code Pink, any organizations assoc. with George Soros, Cair, etc., etc.

[salvageV6]

" You forgot a few other fanatical groups, the ACLU, MORON.Org, Code Pink, any organizations assoc. with George Soros, Cair, etc., etc. "

OUCH! That's where wee gets his main talking points.

Looks like everyone's got you figured out there lefty.

" It's also quite amusing how you go out of your way to find religious whack jobs, then label them "Christians" with the specific intent to put the stink on all Christians, then claim you are not doing it.

YET... you are very quick to pull out the "anti-Semite" card. "

What else would you expect from a pathological liar.

Don't fergit the "redneck" label bashing as well.

[Weester]

Salvage,

Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz........

[Weester]

"You forgot a few other fanatical groups, the ACLU, MORON.Org, Code Pink, any organizations assoc. with George Soros, Cair, etc., etc."

Yeah right.............Like they are a threat................LMAO!

A bunch of over zealous lefties..............YES!

[henschman]

i definitely don't believe in having to obtain permission from the government to engage in free speech, like some cities require, and i am absolutely not for banning the speech of certain groups just because they are deemed "hateful," "radical," etc... but this phelps group is something else! i really don't see how they can get away with what they do. maybe somebody who knows more about it can explain, but it seems to me that almost every cemetary is privately-owned, which means that the owner can exclude anyone he wants for whatever reason he wants. i have no idea why these protesters are even allowed into the cemetary, unless the funerals are happening in government-run cemetaries like arlington. even there, you could say that veterans' cemetaries are basically benefits paid to veterans, in compensation for their service to the country. no one should have the right to interfere with such benefits. it would be analogous to someone stealing a soldier's paycheck or VA check, and would not be covered by free speech.

in short, when a funeral happens on private property, the property owner or the sheriff should kick these people's sorry asses out. if it happens in a military cemetary, the u.s. marshalls or whoever should kick them out. what's the problem?

[IEATV8S]

Originally Posted by Weester

"You forgot a few other fanatical groups, the ACLU, MORON.Org, Code Pink, any organizations assoc. with George Soros, Cair, etc., etc."

Yeah right.............Like they are a threat................LMAO!

A bunch of over zealous lefties..............YES!

I seem to remember a group called the Weather Underground, a bunch of radical lefties that blew up things, including themselves finally!

[The Blob]

Originally Posted by Weester

Whos defending them???? There are people in this country that would defend their right to protest based on the 1st amendment! Its absurd!

I misread your post

Same could be said for those who claim ALL Muslims are out to destroy all non-believers!

I don't think anybody says ALL muslims are out to destroy non-believers. That being said, I would just as soon get rid of ALL muslims, though, because you can't tell the good from the bad and the good will not even denounce, let alone turn in, their bad brethren.

[BlownZ]

Originally Posted by The Blob

I misread your post




I don't think anybody says ALL muslims are out to destroy non-believers. That being said, I would just as soon get rid of ALL muslims, though, because you can't tell the good from the bad and the good will not even denounce, let alone turn in, their bad brethren.

Do you feel the same way about Harlem?

[The Blob]

Originally Posted by BlownZ

Do you feel the same way about Harlem?

If a segment of the black population declared war on non-blacks, then killed several thousand people in one massive attack... yes, I would.

[BlownZ]

Originally Posted by The Blob

If a segment of the black population declared war on non-blacks, then killed several thousand people in one massive attack... yes, I would.

Isn't that happening in Africa right now?

[The Blob]

Originally Posted by BlownZ

Isn't that happening in Africa right now?

Harlem... Africa... what's your point?




Muslims have declared jihad against America... they killed 3,000 people and they'd like to kill a bunch more. Therefore, I say get rid of all the muslims... send them all back to Muslamia or wherever they came from. Agree or disagree, that seems like simple enough logic.

Now you are talking about Harlem and Africa. Why?

I really don't give a crap what goes on in Africa. That may be mean, but that's me. <shrug>

[BlownZ]

Originally Posted by The Blob

Harlem... Africa... what's your point?




Muslims have declared jihad against America... they killed 3,000 people and they'd like to kill a bunch more. Therefore, I say get rid of all the muslims... send them all back to Muslamia or wherever they came from. Agree or disagree, that seems like simple enough logic.

Now you are talking about Harlem and Africa. Why?

I really don't give a crap what goes on in Africa. That may be mean, but that's me. <shrug>

My point my dull witted friend is that you cannot condemn an entire race for the actions of a few.

The Black Panther party declared jihad on whitey back in the day....sure they never killed a few thousand people all at once....but not for lack of wanting to do it.

I won't ask you any more difficult questions.

[a trail rider]

The idea of killing an entire race doesn't strike me as worthy. That said, there should be something serious done to curtail the wreckless abandon of the radicals who are attacking where/when they can, including attacks against their own peoples, somehow stupidly convinced they'll get virgins in Heaven, etc...

Originally Posted by The Blob

If a segment of the black population declared war on non-blacks, then killed several thousand people in one massive attack... yes, I would.

Originally Posted by BlownZ

Isn't that happening in Africa right now?

What's this about? Several thousand non-blacks have been killed by blacks in Africa? Seems like a really big stretch to correlate Harlem to Africa. That's like Barack Obama claiming he's as "African" as his is "American"...

There's a genocide of sorts going on in Africa, yes. But it isn't blacks against non-blacks and it isn't in the name of Jihad either. Plus, the killing of thousands didn't happen all at once. I agree, there's a huge problem there. That has nothing at all to do with what's happening in the rest of the worlds' conflicts.

Btw, are there not those people who condemn the entire white race? We're seeing that condemnation quite openly based on claims of things which supposedly(and many really did) happened more than 100 yrs ago, and in many cases, more than 200 yrs agao right here in America. People who never knew anyone involved are now standing up and condemning whites and sticking their hand out for the whites to fill it with money because of things they claim happened to people they never spent a tick or tock with. Point there? Entire races get condemned for things they had nothing to do with on a daily basis.

[mcasteel2112]

Although they couldnt get into Arlington when we buried Andy, they did show up for a funeral here in Flint and was chased outta town before it took place, no reason was givin but i remember seeing the news clip with the cameras on them as they were packing up and they looked scared.

glad they got judgment against them

[The Blob]

Originally Posted by BlownZ

My point my dull witted friend is that you cannot condemn an entire race for the actions of a few.

Whenever you get yourself into a losing position you start throwing out the insults... never fails.

I can condemn an entire race for the actions of a few if I want to... especially when the entire race does not condemn the actions of the few. You may not agree, but I can do it.

I think we should send all the muslims home because of 9/11 and their stated desire to do it again. You may agree or disagree but the logic is at least linear.

You, on the other hand, try to manufacture some analogy that doesn't exist. Harlem? Africa? Black Panthers? Want to keep trying? It's not working so far.

If you would like to discuss why we should cut the muslims a break and not send them all home I will be glad to do that. But if you continue to interject non sequitur into the conversion it's going to be difficult.

[BlownZ]

Originally Posted by The Blob

Whenever you get yourself into a losing position you start throwing out the insults... never fails.

Not you too. Oh Vay.

I can condemn an entire race for the actions of a few if I want to... especially when the entire race does not condemn the actions of the few. You may not agree, but I can do it.

Yes you can. I should have said a reasonably intelligent person wouldn't condemn an entire race for the actions of a few.

I think we should send all the muslims home because of 9/11 and their stated desire to do it again. You may agree or disagree but the logic is at least linear.

I think if we send them home...we should send everyone home.

You, on the other hand, try to manufacture some analogy that doesn't exist. Harlem? Africa? Black Panthers? Want to keep trying? It's not working so far.

I was thinking on a different level and trying to get you to realize how silly your statement of condemning millions of people because of the actions of a few.

If everyone thought that way....it would be easy for a handful of people to manipulate the actions of entire countries.....nations would react to the actions of a small vocal group of whackos.

I realize my analogies missed the mark...but I don't know if it is the fault of the analogy or the mark.

If you would like to discuss why we should cut the muslims a break and not send them all home I will be glad to do that. But if you continue to interject non sequitur into the conversion it's going to be difficult.

Sure...let's do it. These are always fun and usually end up with you posting some of these.........

My first question......Would you send Muslims who were born in America and are American citizens home too?