STP oil treatment in red bottle-where to find it?

[GNRick]

Anybody know where to find it? Can't find it at usual places like Autozone, Advance, O'reilly's, Walmart. They only carry the blue bottle. I emailed STP but probably won't get a reply until Monday or Tues. Their website says Ace Hardware carries their products. Haven't checked there yet. Thanks.

[Chuck Leeper]

Originally Posted by GNRick

Anybody know where to find it? Can't find it at usual places like Autozone, Advance, O'reilly's, Walmart. They only carry the blue bottle. I emailed STP but probably won't get a reply until Monday or Tues. Their website says Ace Hardware carries their products. Haven't checked there yet. Thanks.

If it's antiwear additive you want:
post on this very product. It appears that the stuff has so little ZDDP, that it's worthless, once diluted w/ 5 qts of oil.
Someone posted a link to a source of concentrated ZDDp..
Here's the link:
ZddPlus - Purchase - ZDDP Additive for Classic Cars - Agricultural Equipement
Maybe do a search?
Here's a start:
Amsoil has ZDDP

[2NASSTYBUICKS]

You can also buy zddp through Kirbans IF you are in the inner circle.It isn't listed in their catalog.

[GNRick]

Originally Posted by Chuck Leeper

If it's antiwear additive you want:
post on this very product. It appears that the stuff has so little ZDDP, that it's worthless, once diluted w/ 5 qts of oil.
[/url]

Chuck- how do you know it is almost worthless? I was going from this website: VOA Oil Test Results

STP is listed third from the bottom.

[Chuck Leeper]

Originally Posted by GNRick

Chuck- how do you know it is almost worthless? I was going from this website: VOA Oil Test Results

STP is listed third from the bottom.

Article, [postings] in the link I posted. It looks like someone with "several dozen" GN's, has done considerable work, looking at the products.
When I mentioned the STP, I was replied to with those posts..
I'm not into lab testing oils, as I use mostly roller cams, and have had zero cam lobe losses, in any of the engines I've built, V-sicks, or others...
To carry this 1 step further, I also look at, and correct, any lifter location issues I find. Be it bore diameter/finish, or location in the block. Attention to the above, has certainly helped me avoid the cam failures.

However, I do sell engine hoists

[GNRick]

From Chuck's source and my source, here are the results. First is Phos., second is Zinc:

Amsoil 10W-40 1265 1378
amsoil 20W-50 1266 1379

STP Red 2115 3932
STP Blue 1704 2436

I don't know how much Phosphorus and Zinc Kirban's has in it. I just found STP red at True Value but it was $4 per container. Most places have the blue container for $2.18.

[A2000RICH]

Originally Posted by GNRick

From Chuck's source and my source, here are the results. First is Phos., second is Zinc:

Amsoil 10W-40 1265 1378
amsoil 20W-50 1266 1379

STP Red 2115 3932
STP Blue 1704 2436

I don't know how much Phosphorus and Zinc Kirban's has in it. I just found STP red at True Value but it was $4 per container. Most places have the blue container for $2.18.

Rick-------think about it for a minute------if you use the amzoil the percentage will stay the same since that is the concentration IN THE OIL itself------as for the STP it is in a 15 oz bottle ------a 5 quart oil change is about 160 oz so when you add the STP to your oil it is diluted by ten times ------this means that you have to add one more decimal point the those numbers of zinc and phosp-------at that point it is esentially useless------one more thing to think about-------any additive that has enough real zddp to do any good would have to be marked for off road, not for OBD cars etc.---------i believe conformance to this legal issue is why GM stopped selling EOS------ZddPlus has ten times the zddp of STP and twice what EOS had per bottle --------it was formulated with GN's in mind and one bottle is exactly what a GN needs for the use of modern SM oil..........................RC

[A2000RICH]

rick----one more thought------i went to the site you put in your post-----i can tell you one thing about that chart with absolute certainty------i can state that a lot of those values are totally out of date-------i have done lots of tests in the last 90 days and the phosporus numbers are dropping almost weekly------mobil one 10-30 and valvoline 10-30 have virtually ZERO phosp--------i'm not exactly sure what is happening since the spec for SM oil states there is no limit for zinc but phosp should be 0.06 min to 0.08 max--------in case you don't know you can't have zddp unless you have both in almost equal amounts------i am trying to figure out what the oil companies are up to but at the moment i have discovered that the spec for phosp is classified as NON CRITICAL in the ASTM specifications------the same documents also say that with failure of a non critical spec the product will not lose certification but that a "provisional certification will be granted"--------protection of our older cars may not be important to the ASTM, ISLAC or the API but it is to me and thats why i came up with ZddPlus...........................RC

[GNRick]

Looks like I'll be buying some ZddPlus.

[turbo nasty]

Paul Vanderly, very high end engine builder here locally, who among several other accomplishments developed Heads for GM and Nascar in the 80's and Brodix still uses his design on their high end heads.

Long story short.... I spoke with them in detail about the oil concerns/reduction of zinc/reformulation of the oils on the market. And discovered that in the past couple of years he has noticed above and beyond the wiping lobe issue, also increased wear in bearings in engines. This is after extensive dyno testing, race engine post season, etc.
He has tried several oils on the market and the Joe Gibbs racing oil is giving him the best results as far as protection/ high zinc content, he says, "like the old oils used to protect."

Joe Gibbs Racing Oil - www.joegibbsracingoil.com

Rich test this stuff and get back with us on it.

[tthorngen]

yeah. im not paying 228 for a 12pk case

[tthorngen]

read it again. thats the most expensive one they carry. heh. still expensive... il stick with additive

[GNRick]

I have been in contact with STP regarding their oil treatment. Here is their latest reply. Substitute "whether" for "rather" and it will make sense:

Reference Number: 5094560

Dear Mr. Pikowsky,


Thank you for contacting us about STP Oil Treatment - 4-Cylinder. We always appreciate hearing from our consumers.



The MSDS does list the ingredients in our products. The SF designation was simply a code assigned by SAE. Our product when added to the 4-5 quarts of the oil blends available today rather it be synthetic or regular oil will meet the standards that were used with the SF designation. Our product contains the maximum that the EPA will allow, in any oil additive.



Again, thank you for contacting us.



Sincerely,





Patti Copper


Consumer Response Representative


Consumer Services

[A2000RICH]

Originally Posted by GNRick

I have been in contact with STP regarding their oil treatment. Here is their latest reply. Substitute "whether" for "rather" and it will make sense:

Reference Number: 5094560

Dear Mr. Pikowsky,


Thank you for contacting us about STP Oil Treatment - 4-Cylinder. We always appreciate hearing from our consumers.



The MSDS does list the ingredients in our products. The SF designation was simply a code assigned by SAE. Our product when added to the 4-5 quarts of the oil blends available today rather it be synthetic or regular oil will meet the standards that were used with the SF designation. Our product contains the maximum that the EPA will allow, in any oil additive.



Again, thank you for contacting us.



Sincerely,





Patti Copper


Consumer Response Representative


Consumer Services

now thats a real "dancearound"------that last sentence tells it all------maximum allowed by the EPA------that means its ok for newer cars and doesn't have enough of the stuff you care about to meet the needs of older cars------like i said if it really had enough i would have to be marked "off road" or for "racing" only or something similar--------i have tested both types of STP and it has just enough zddp to say it has some, not enough to do you any good............RC